T500- Flat battery, why does it do this

MikeH1A · Post by **MikeH1A** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 5:15 am

I tried to start the T500R after a couple of weeks lay up. Usually she starts 1st or 2nd kick. This time I had to use prime and also full choke. When she started it was rough, sounding like one cylinder and as I eased the choke off she died - then wouldn't start again. I mentioned this to a mate who has the same model. He said to check the battery as his performs like that when the battery is low or dead i.e. rough as, hard to start and only on one cylinder. So, I checked the battery and sure enough it was pretty low on charge. Once fully charged, she started 2nd kick and ran on two cylinders.

Why (and how) does it act like that when the battery is low/dead. What's the relationship between charge and running on one cylinder?

I'm intrigued - and glad it was something so easy.

ja-moo · Post by **ja-moo** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 11:44 am

You just end up with a very weak spark, and when it's that low, it just has enough energy to spark the easiest system.

H2RICK · Post by **H2RICK** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 1:07 pm

JA +1

Mike, I don't know what kind of battery you have in there but Titans are VERY hard on batteries because of the vibration. It sounds like you may have one cell going bad on you. A good battery should NOT lose its charge after just two weeks or so.
Just as a check, I'd set my meter to Amps and hook it up between the positive post of the battery (red meter lead) and the hot wire in the harness (black meter lead)....key OFF !!!
No reading on the meter ??? Switch the meter to the Milliamps range and watch for a reading. Still no reading ?? Then there's no leakage/partial ground anywhere and your battery is probably on the way out.

I STRONGLY recommend the expensive Yuasa "Black Box" battery for any older bike. They're well built and cost about 50% more than the cheap Chinese crap batteries.....BUT with care and adding only DISTILLED water when necessary, 5 years of life is possible. The el cheapo batteries MAY last for 2 years....maybe.....if you're lucky.

The "Black Box" nickname for the high end battery comes from the colour of the carton that they come in.

My .02 worth....

MikeH1A · Post by **MikeH1A** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 3:50 pm

Thanks for that guys. Moo what are you doing over here????

This battery was in the old girl when I bought her about 2 years ago. So, it probably is on it's way to wherever old batteries go when they give up the ghost. I think I might invest in a new - sturdier- model as suggested.

In the meantime, the weather is hot as here, so I shall be out riding on her today.

Happy New Year to you guys. Ride safe.

Mike

tz375 · Post by **tz375** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 4:56 pm

Q. What type of alternator is fited to that bike? The later GT used a magneto or self generating system that will start without a battery.

the GT750 uses one with an electo magnet rather than a permanent magnet system and they need a fresh charge to get the alternator charging.

Many permanent magnet systems don't generate enough power at kickover speed to charge the battery enough to fire a bike with a flat battery.

bikegeezer · Post by **bikegeezer** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:01 am

H2RICK wrote: I STRONGLY recommend the expensive Yuasa "Black Box" battery for any older bike. They're well built and cost about 50% more than the cheap Chinese crap batteries.....BUT with care and adding only DISTILLED water when necessary, 5 years of life is possible. The el cheapo batteries MAY last for 2 years....maybe.....if you're lucky.

The "Black Box" nickname for the high end battery comes from the colour of the carton that they come in.

My .02 worth....

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but Yuasa (USA) stopped making flooded style batteries for the North American market about a year ago. They couldn't compete with the Asian Rim pricing. So now they import from Taiwan. They still make Batteries in the Reading plant, but they're all sealed AGM.

Stu

rngdng · Post by **rngdng** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:21 am

I've been buying AGMs from "Batteries Plus", a big battery retail chain. They seem to work well and last about 2 years, with minimal use. If I rode the bikes more often, I'm sure they'd last longer.

Lane

bikegeezer · Post by **bikegeezer** » Fri Jan 01, 2010 6:17 am

rngdng wrote:I've been buying AGMs from "Batteries Plus", a big battery retail chain. They seem to work well and last about 2 years, with minimal use. If I rode the bikes more often, I'm sure they'd last longer.

Lane

That's the trouble with having a lot of bikes lying around. You could swap a charger between them, but who can remember when's the last time any particular one got charged? So I got one of these and took the batteries out of the bikes I don't ride often. This thing keep 'em all fresh and ready to use, and they last a lot longer. But you do need to keep an eye on the fluid level on the ones that aren't AGM. They seem to need topping up about every 60 days.

Stu

ja-moo · Post by **ja-moo** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 9:41 pm

MikeH1A wrote:Thanks for that guys. Moo what are you doing over here????

Well....... the Suki guys are a good lot, though there are a lot of pink bikes......

And they are doing some cool mods, and I like to keep up.

As far as chargers go, I just bought a couple from Harbor Freight. They are supposedly self regulating so not a constant charge like a trickle charger. So no water burn off (well, so far)7 or 8 bucks each.

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:19 am

I had a Taiwanese lead acid battery last 6! years in my GS1000. No maintenance at all. Top and charge it in the spring and GO.

H2RICK · Post by **H2RICK** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:51 pm

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but Yuasa (USA) stopped making flooded style batteries for the North American market about a year ago.

Well, that's interesting news, Stu. It'll be interesting also to check out the new distributor catalogues that will be coming out in the next 2-3 months to see what they'll be offering in lieu of the high-end Yuasa lead-acid batteries.
Maybe....just maybe....the Taiwanese will have learned enough from making the Yuasa Turbo (white box) line of batteries that they can carve themselves out a market niche with a product comparable to the black box Yuasa product. Otherwise, it's AGM batteries for everyone cuz I refuse to use the low rent crap from the (so-called) Peoples' Republic.

Post by **Suzsmokeyallan** » Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:19 pm

UNLESS of course its all the local store has when youre stranded in Hope B.C,,,, you forgot to mention that bit Rick.

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Tue Jan 05, 2010 6:30 am

AGM's are nice but you have to make sure your regulator is working okay. It's possible to force them to vent (voltage too high) and it's very difficult/virtually impossible to add water. That is the one advantage of wet cells.

I've got about 4 years on the battery in my T500 now and suspect it's getting weak. I've also found that rather than removing the batteries during the winter for indoor storage, the self-discharge rate is lower when cold so I just leave them in the bike and charge slightly in the springtime.

H2RICK · Post by **H2RICK** » Sun Jan 10, 2010 12:41 am

I've also found that rather than removing the batteries during the winter for indoor storage, the self-discharge rate is lower when cold so I just leave them in the bike and charge slightly in the springtime.

Well, Frank, that method might be okay where you live but we "snow-belt" guys that can see weeks and months of below freezing temps really can't take chances like that. If/when the battery goes completely flat then it freezes and cracks. At that point, theoretically what pours all over your bike is water....but water shouldn't eat the heck out of your chrome and paint.
I guess there's a point on the chart where the ambient temp curve crosses the elevated freeze point of the weakened acid solution and....bingo....crackage occurs and the sulphuric acid gets all over everything.