Smooth shifting but smokes like crazy, need advice..

[LexPaul]

Hey guys,

My 1970 T500. It had 11200 miles when I bought it - runs pretty good except when it exceeds 70 mph, then it starts to hesitate - I have 11700 miles on it now.

The guy I bought it from said he changed the transmission oil but I did not like the way it shifted, especially in 4 and 5. It was not smooth, so I decided to change the transmission oil at 11700 miles. I bought Belray gearsaver 80w. I drained the oil, all three plugs, looks like 10w40 came out, but not very much, only 500cc, i measured it, not good. I added the required 1400cc based on the Suzuki Forum threads below. Shifts great but started smoking like a bandit. Can you make any suggestions. I noted that some guys mentioned a leak down test, is this something I need to do, to see if the crank seals are bad? Any advice is appreciated.

LexPaul

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http://www.vjmog.com/ftopict-8630-t500. ... mission+oi" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[LexPaul]

Hi Lex, if you only drained 500cc out of all 3 plugs then you have a problem, the grotty 4/5 is probably down to hardening going on the gears, when you refilled with 1400cc unless the level mod was done you will have too much oil in the primary case, you can do a leakdown test if you want to go to the bother of making the kit for a one off job!!
If its smoking on both then centre seal has probably gone (most likely) and you could have damaged the centre bearing through lack of lube.

Personally I'd put a £10 note down your seals have gone and have buggered 4/5 gears

I'm thinking I'll drain 200cc out of the transmission and leave 1200cc inside, see if that changes anything. Thanks for the note.

[H2RICK]

That BelRay 85W Gearsaver is pretty light oil. The comparable viscosity in an engine oil is ~10 weight. You might want to try their 85W which is comparable to an SAE 20 weight. If your centre crank seals are marginal, the 15 weight will get through whereas the 20 weight MAY stay where it's supposed to.
Otherwise......Pedro +1.

[titan performance]

A customer of ours commented on a smokey left cylinder, but continued to ride without looking into it. Then, surprise surprise, 3rd gear becomes noisy !
We have since removed his engine ready for a strip down, and less than 500cc came out of the box !

[LexPaul]

Okay, lots of good advice, I drained 200cc out of the tranny today and the smoke issue was lessened. Maybe not where I want it to be, but at least it's not super ugly. Mainly smoking during warmup and if i lay down the throttle hard! Seems to be shifting okay, but I like smoother action and i wonder if maybe my sites are set to high. I think I'll drain the oil out Monday and see how much comes out, to determine if it is burning a lot. I may even try the thicker viscosity Belray 85w oil and see how that works. I've got one of the triple forum guys living near by, he's going to help troubleshoot and i'll report findings. Thanks guys..

[LexPaul]

Wanted to finish this thread. So I drained the tranny oil Monday and it was down to 500cc again. The motor is obviously burning it and it sorta levels out at 500cc. I refilled it to 1200cc and it started smoking again. I am so bummed out, I love this bike, what do I do while I'm having it rebuilt, sit with my thumb up my ass! bummer, bummer, bummer...

[H2RICK]

Less thumb.....
more working.....
that way you won't notice the time passing by.....and you just MAY get to ride this season after all.
Sorry for your problems, though.

[Suzsmokeyallan]

Thats why many people on this forum have MORE than one bike, it has been known to keep you sane and busy.

[zee]

got my69/70 same model as yours t500 running and it also smokes like a gardener180 on a frosty morning lol been stood a long time (5000 miles on clock and original tyres) all rubbers rotted away ect well rusty hope it will clear when i can run it under load taking it for mot tomorrow then try to get it registered hopefully i can then try it out in a couple of weeks but after reading this thread it looks like ive got to save some pennys and make a trip to eye eh pedro yours alan from sunny walsall uk

[LexPaul]

Ok guys, here's the story update and photos below, so I found a great mechanic, Tom (Cat) Loftis from the Kawasaki Triples WorldWide Forum - http://kawasakitriplesworldwide.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - he's an ex-dragbike type and he knew exactly what needed to be done.

1) pulled the motor and broke down the engine - compression was 150 on both sides before we took apart.
2) Rebult the Crankshaft - new seals - new rod arms - new bearings - what a treasure hunt that turned out to be.
**** Much, Much appreciation goes to Ron Anchak http://www.anchakandsons.com/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - for some of these hard to find parts - he had a set of rod arms and the big and small end bearings, etc. It was a miracle really.
**** Thanks to Rising Sun Cycles in Harriman, TN for their help with the crankshaft rebuild. I got them the parts and they had that put back together in one afternoon, mic'd and trued
**** Credit must go to Sundial Eric Kalamaja - he had the time to help me with valuable advice and I will be forever thankful for this. He was very patient when I asked a 100 questions.
3) Scored a NOS fifth (5th) driven gear from a guy in South Africa on eBay - mine was actually in good shape, just a little light blue from heat but no damage, cracks, pitting (I will trade it to anyone that wants). I just figured I'd replace it while I had this monster apart. I'm ready to go until end of century I hope!
4) Scored the Mission Plate Oil Modification (see pic) part from Greg Clauss Studios http://www.ClaussStudios.com" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; - What a great help he was and he had other parts that I wanted as well.
5) Putting this thing together now - will update you once finished

PS - I spoke to Greg at NewTronics and he is sending me an electronic ignition for my T500 - about $250.00

PS - Tom, my mechanic would have had this build completed, but when he went to assemble the transmission / 5th gear, he thought the bearing felt "a little rough". Told me to replace, just to have peace of mind. What can a guy say? Another 50.00 NOS part and the dude on eBay sent it to me from CA

PS - I have one good used rod arm and one good used 5th driven gear if anyone wants to trade

PS - I have a 1971 model T500 engine that I will trade parts off too..

[ConnerVT]

Had a chuckle when I saw the picture of your engine-less frame. Looks like what was in my garage until last week. Now mine has even less parts on it. (It is chrome and aluminum weeks here - polishing everything up, while I wait for my crank and jugs to return from being serviced).

I can relate to most everything you've been through. I too hit a wall for some time, tracking down what I need to get the project moving again. I'm sure you feel good, now that you are headed back to the reassembly stage!

[LexPaul]

Had a chuckle when I saw the picture of your engine-less frame. Looks like what was in my garage until last week. Now mine has even less parts on it. (It is chrome and aluminum weeks here - polishing everything up, while I wait for my crank and jugs to return from being serviced).

I can relate to most everything you've been through. I too hit a wall for some time, tracking down what I need to get the project moving again. I'm sure you feel good, now that you are headed back to the reassembly stage!

I wouldn't really want anyone to have to do this, but this bike is gonna be something you just don't see everyday, and I'm really glad that it'll be running for a good while longer. I hope my son will one day appreciate it. Post some pics of yours. By the way, what are you doing/using to polish yours up exactly. Post some pics when you have time..

[ConnerVT]

Just finished a polishing session. I haven't taken to many before/after pictures of the chrome, as it probably won't show the difference in a photo. But the eyes can definitely see the difference.

My bike was in pretty good shape (except for the engine!) considering it was last on the road in 1996 (if I believe the GA license plate that was on the back when delivered). The painted parts look good factory paint, and the large chrome had some minor rust pitting. The smaller chrome pieces looked pretty bad.

For the small pieces (such as the front fender brackets, chain guard) I've been soaking them for a day in Evaporust. Does an amazing job removing the worst of the rust. Then it is equal parts chrome polish, 0000 steel wool, and elbow grease. (Maybe an extra dose of the elbow grease.) I then protect it with a good coat of Carnauba wax.

I hate having to use the steel wool, but given the choice of light scratches in the chrome vs. brown rust spots, I'll take the scratches. My goal is to have a nice daily rider, so it is an easy trade off for me.

Tomorrow, I begin my adventure of aluminum polishing. I have all my gear ready to go, and I'll start the morning by putting the paint stripper to the engine side covers. There are a couple of minor scratches to sand out, then to the 6" buffer to make them all shiny. I will take before/after shots of those, as (I hope) the difference will be more remarkable.

It's funny how, with a quick look, a bike can look good until you start digging below the surface. Below is a picture on delivery day, and one taken a few days after.

Delivered.jpg

Uncovered.jpg

[LexPaul]

Just finished a polishing session. I haven't taken to many before/after pictures of the chrome, as it probably won't show the difference in a photo. But the eyes can definitely see the difference.

My bike was in pretty good shape (except for the engine!) considering it was last on the road in 1996 (if I believe the GA license plate that was on the back when delivered). The painted parts look good factory paint, and the large chrome had some minor rust pitting. The smaller chrome pieces looked pretty bad.

For the small pieces (such as the front fender brackets, chain guard) I've been soaking them for a day in Evaporust. Does an amazing job removing the worst of the rust. Then it is equal parts chrome polish, 0000 steel wool, and elbow grease. (Maybe an extra dose of the elbow grease.) I then protect it with a good coat of Carnauba wax.

I hate having to use the steel wool, but given the choice of light scratches in the chrome vs. brown rust spots, I'll take the scratches. My goal is to have a nice daily rider, so it is an easy trade off for me.

Tomorrow, I begin my adventure of aluminum polishing. I have all my gear ready to go, and I'll start the morning by putting the paint stripper to the engine side covers. There are a couple of minor scratches to sand out, then to the 6" buffer to make them all shiny. I will take before/after shots of those, as (I hope) the difference will be more remarkable.

It's funny how, with a quick look, a bike can look good until you start digging below the surface. Below is a picture on delivery day, and one taken a few days after.

Delivered.jpg

Uncovered.jpg

That is one good looking bike, Kim love that rear rack, do you think that evaporust would work if you just painted it on with a brush and let it stay until dry, repeat, etc. let us know how the aluminum comes out. I too consider my bike a rider, I try not to go nuts, making it showroom clean, just keeping it tidy and neat, I like it that others appreciate what you have when you pull up popping and smoking..

[ConnerVT]

No, the Evaporust wont work just brushed on. It does need to soak. But it is harmless to both paint and chrome, so quite a useful tool.

My feelings about my luggage rack are mixed. I certainly can use one. visually, it may be a bit large for the bike. But a nice thing is the entire backrest part is removable.