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 Post subject: Electrical part sources
PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 8:24 pm 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: southwestern Pennsylvania
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 69 T350 thru 75 GT750
rectifier / regulator / electrical connectors

You should check both sites for electrical connector prices, availability & quantities.

Oregon Motorcycle Parts http://www.oregonmotorcycleparts.com/

Electrical connectors on the "Connector" page.

For GT380/GT550/GT750:
direct replacement for rectifier (R255-SGT as shown on the "5 & 6 Wire Rectifier" page).
direct replacement for voltage regulator (VR3-SGT as shown on the "Voltage Regulators" page). Just need to swap out voltage regulator connector with existing one.

For T250/T350/T500/GT250:
rectifier (one of the R42a as shown on the "2, 3 & 4 Wire Rectifier" page). Can use same mounting as original unit. Does not have connectors for original wiring harness.
regulator/rectifier (VRRPM2 as shown on the "Regulator / Rectifier PM" page). Replaces both the rectifier & voltage regulator. Requires custom mounting. A lot more capacity than need for stock T250/T350/T500 alternators.

Vintage Connections http://www.vintageconnections.com/

Electrical connectors

_________________
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 project & 75
GT380 72
T500 73 project
T350 69, 71 & 72 project
T250 72
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE


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PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 8:50 pm 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: southwestern Pennsylvania
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 69 T350 thru 75 GT750
coils

Rex Caunt Racing http://rexcauntracing.com

They sell new coils. When switching to their coils on my GT750, I got a quite noticeable reduction in vibration.

For T250/T350/T500/GT250/GT380/GT550/GT750
Only source for coils I've found with correct dimension & primary resistance.
They sell 2.5 & 4 ohm coils. Make sure you get 4 ohm coils. See: http://rexcauntracing.com/pages/htcoils.html

They also sell via eBay & you may see their coils listed. Check: http://stores.ebay.com/Rex-Caunt-Racing

The coils will mount differently that stock coils. The ignition wire is centered over the mounting screw on the Suzuki coils. Its offset on Rex's coils.

GT380/GT550 coil installation:
You can install the coils with the ignition lead facing forward if you want. Otherwise see GT750 instructions.

GT750 coil instructions:
Coolant tank interferes when mounting with ignition leads facing forward.
As a result you will need to flip one of Rex's coils over to mount them on the bike.

This is how I installed them on the coil bracket for my GT750.
Attachment:
RexCoilsGT750a.jpg
RexCoilsGT750a.jpg [ 93.83 KiB | Viewed 38294 times ]


I filed down the corner on the bracket near the right coil to slightly increase the gap between the bracket and ignition wire.

Stock coils are mounted with two coils to the right of the GT750 centerline and use two bolts to mount the bracket to the frame.
I mounted the coils with two coils to the left of the center line. Used one bolt in the existing hole. Could drill a second mounting hole if you want.
Attachment:
RexCoilsGT750b.jpg
RexCoilsGT750b.jpg [ 154.14 KiB | Viewed 38294 times ]


T250/T350/T500/GT250 instructions:
Mount coils in either direction. Flip one coil over if mounting with leads facing toward rear of bike.

_________________
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 project & 75
GT380 72
T500 73 project
T350 69, 71 & 72 project
T250 72
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 11:48 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: southwestern Pennsylvania
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 69 T350 thru 75 GT750
electronic ignition systems

NewTronic http://www.newtronic.co.uk/
NewTronic is available in the US at HVCcycle: http://www.hvccycle.com/ignition-newtronic.html
They also sell via eBay & you may see their systems listed. Check: http://shop.ebay.com/autocar-electrical/m.html?_nkw=suzuki&_sacat=0&_odkw=&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3911.c0.m270.l1313

AutoCar acquired the company, and has been updating their products.

They used to have one kit for the triples & you had to assemble the parts differently for the GT550. Now have different kits for the GT380/GT750 & GT550.
They used to have a kit for the T500. Am inclined to think they will eventually release an updated kit for it.
Also have a kit for the T250/T350/GT250 for 1975 & earlier. Have read some older online posts about installation issues, but the kit may have been updated to solve the issues.

Review of older kit for GT750: http://medial.com/suzuki/newtronic/
The base plate for the pickups appears to be plastic in the older kit. I have the updated kit, and the base plate is now metal.
Also, the base plate for the older kit has stickers for GT550 installation.

Boyer Bransden http://www.boyerbransden.com/
They have a kit for the triples but have discontinued kits for the GT250/T500.
Oldjapanesebikes has noted that the kits are designed for Kawasaki triples and are a bit of a pain to install. See his posts for more info:
http://oldjapanesebikes.com/blog/2010/07/07/gt750-boyer-bransden-ignition-round-3/
http://www.oldjapanesebikes.com/gt550/gt550%20ignition.html
http://www.oldjapanesebikes.com/gt750/gt750%20ignition.html#Electronic_Ignition

Accent http://www.accent-electronic.com/ELZ2Coil.html
Accent GT380/GT750 kit looks very interesting. Kit will not work on GT550. Looks easy to install, but reliability is unproven at this time.
Oldjapanesebikes has purchased this kit, so we may learn more about it soon.

Classic Suzuki Parts NL http://www.suzukitandgtparts.nl/begin_gt.htm Look under Hot Parts.
Kits for triples & twins.

Powerdynamo http://www.powerdynamo.biz/deu/systems/lists/suzuki.php
Their kits are more expensive, but they also replace the alternator and coils.
Should be a good choice for the T250/T350/GT250/T500 because you'll also upgrade their rather dismal alternators. Will allow you to upgrade to a 55/60W H4 headlight. Not sure about use for GT380/GT550/GT750, looks like the stock alternators might have higher output.
Jaybob installed the kit & may be able to provide more info if you need it.

With the exception of Accent, all of the systems get favorable performance/reliability reviews & comments. Generally would expect this given how long electronic ignition systems have been around.
The Accent kit may also turn out to provide good reliability -- am not sure what to expect since it exposes the electronics to higher temperatures & vibrations.

My current personal preferences...
I would upgrade to a modern voltage regulator or rectifier/regulator to protect the electronics for any of these kits.
For the triples I'd pick the NewTronic kit. Might prefer the Accent kit after its reliability is proven.
For twins, if you are OK with the stock alternator output, I think I'd go with the Classic Suzuki kit. Otherwise I'd pick the Powerdynamo kit.

_________________
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 project & 75
GT380 72
T500 73 project
T350 69, 71 & 72 project
T250 72
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE


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PostPosted: Wed May 18, 2011 5:33 pm 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:47 am
Posts: 6011
Location: Illinois
For fuse panels
http://easternbeaver.com/Main/Products/ ... /pc-8.html

For relays
http://easternbeaver.com/Main/Elec__Pro ... elays.html

For modern type sealed connectors
http://easternbeaver.com/Main/Elec__Pro ... ealed.html

For braided sleeve and shrink tube
http://cableorganizer.com/wire-management/

Regulator/Rectifier in modern form factor RR77
http://electrexworld.co.uk/rr77-regulat ... 863-0.html

HT coils
http://electrexworld.co.uk/ht13-ht-coil ... 059-0.html

Race ignition kits from HPI or
http://electrexworld.co.uk/stator-kit-g ... 086-0.html

Electronic ignition from Germany with 9 curves to select from
http://www.elektronik-sachse.de/ZDG3/SU ... 750_en.htm

Powerdynamo for GT750 ( that was new one for me)
http://www.powerdynamo.biz/eng/systems/ ... 28main.htm
That kit includes high output charge circuit plus coils plus CDI ignition plus R/R unit. Very complete

Then there's Marcel's unit which is a fit and forget proposition
http://www.suzukitandgtparts.nl/hotpartsen.htm


General ignition comments
http://www.oldjapanesebikes.com/gt750/g ... c_Ignition
Newtronics I imported a few years ago were very ordinary quality and Boyer is not all that impressive either.

There are so many choices now it's almost overwhelming :roll: :?


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 6:50 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: southwestern Pennsylvania
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 69 T350 thru 75 GT750
update on electronic ignition

Newtronic
For thoughts on the quality & installation issues of the older Newtronic kit, see: http://medial.com/suzuki/new/log.html (Scroll down to August 26, 2001.)
Gunnar noted, "the adjustment screws are threaded into the glassfibre circuit board so some care is needed to not overtighten them."
Based on images, I had thought the old base plate was plastic.

I have the updated GT380/GT750 kit. The base plate is now metal, certainly a big improvement. But I don't know if they updated their other kits.

My current personal view...
Who would have ever thought so many new kits would be available for bikes that went out of production 34 years ago.

Electronic ignition systems are mature technology, and I tend to compare them on ease of install, reliability and cost.

I agree with tz375, the glassfibre circuit board of the original Newtronic kit seems pretty lame to me.
But I'm fine with the updated Newtronic kit for the triples. Newtronic kit for twins is TBD.
I don't see an upside to the Boyer Bransden kit.
The Accent kit could be my preferred choice if it proves reliable.
Don't know if the selectable advance curves are worth the additional cost of the Sache-Electronics kit. Maybe a forum member knows?
Classic Suzuki Part's NL / Marcel's kits look nice but a bit more expensive than Newtronic.
Powerdynamo is expensive, but its a good buy for twins because you also get a much better alternator.

Am thinking about the Powerdynamo kit or Marcel's kit for my T500.

_________________
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 project & 75
GT380 72
T500 73 project
T350 69, 71 & 72 project
T250 72
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2011 8:46 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 10:47 am
Posts: 6011
Location: Illinois
I was familiar with Powerdynamo for twins and it looks like a great GT replacement system or T500 upgrade. I hadn't realized that they had developed a system for the triples. SuzukiDave and I looked at fitting snowmobile systems which are similar but generally have a much larger crank nose and needs a thin tapered adapter which I wasn't keen on or they need a new center core to make them work.

It's an analogue system so it can't be programmed unfortunately, but it looks like a great upgrade. All it needs now is a narrower engine cover to take advantage of the slimmer profile.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 7:17 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:55 pm
Posts: 3972
Location: Lancaster Pa.
Country: US
Bikes owned: GT750 x2 97 -1200 Bandit 86 GSXR1100
The Powerdynamo setup is nice alright and over all the price isnt too bad with the setup including new coils , wiring and regulator . I didnt see to total power output listed .. it shows 80w for lighting ?

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 7:59 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:55 pm
Posts: 3972
Location: Lancaster Pa.
Country: US
Bikes owned: GT750 x2 97 -1200 Bandit 86 GSXR1100
asifden wrote:
Could you tell me more … I would love to explore.
http://powerdynamo.biz/eng/systems/7261/7261main.htm

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2012 12:16 pm 
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On the street
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Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2011 10:46 am
Posts: 49
Location: Belgium
I've used these ignitions for almost all the racers I've build, low cost high quality and sometimes an optional light coil.
http://www.hpi.be/index.htm
I've used this site a few times and I always found what I was looking for, for a reasonable price.
http://kojaycat.co.uk/epages/950000457. ... Categories

hope this belongs here
Oh and the hpi people got an excellent customer service :up:


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:16 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: southwestern Pennsylvania
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 69 T350 thru 75 GT750
Update on Powerdynamo...

The alternator output for the GT380/GT550/GT750 is a rather dismal 80W. Keeping the stock alternator on the GT380/GT550/GT750 & using one of the other brands of electronic ignition would therefore be a much better choice.

Recently they have been having problems with loosening magnets.

For more info see: http://www.suzuki2strokes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=6309

_________________
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 project & 75
GT380 72
T500 73 project
T350 69, 71 & 72 project
T250 72
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 4:00 am 
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To the on ramp
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Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:32 am
Posts: 445
Location: North Carolina
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 1974 GT750 B-4 (JDM), 1975 GT750M
TZ, a friend of mine just fitted the Sachse electronic ignition to his Yamaha 400 4-stroke. Have you or anyone else tried it on the the GT750? Would be interested in hearing more about it.

_________________
Proud parent of Quads, Triplets & Twins:
1975 Suzuki GT750 M
1977 Yamaha RD400D
1988 Yamaha FZR400 3EN1 (JDM)
2016 Yamaha XSR900


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 5:55 am 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:55 pm
Posts: 3972
Location: Lancaster Pa.
Country: US
Bikes owned: GT750 x2 97 -1200 Bandit 86 GSXR1100
Its a interesting setup alright and does have the advantage of 9 different timing curves . http://www.elektronik-sachse.de/ZDG3/SU ... 750_en.htm

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 11:47 am 
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AMA Superbike
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Posts: 1642
Location: Cowtown aka Calgary, Canada
Country: CANADA
Bikes owned: GT550A, GSF1200SK6 currently
Quote:
The alternator output for the GT380/GT550/GT750 is a rather dismal 80W.


Really ?? Now I know my electrical theory is kind of sketchy but for DC circuits Watts = Volts x Amps. Sooo.....taking the info from the output chart for the ND alternator for the 380 and 550, for instance, we see that MAX output at 6000RPM is ~28 amps @ a constant 14VDC.
This then gives us 14 x 28 = 392 watts.
But that's silly because no one rides around at 6000RPM, so we go back down the curve to 3000RPM which is a more realistic engine speed and we have 24 amps at that point. This gives us 14 x 24 =336 watts.
These numbers are "ideal" lab numbers and would probably be somewhat lower in actual service.

So, have I missed something here ?? I'm all eyes/ears because my electrical knowledge can always use some upgrading. :lol:

BTW, the Kokusan alternator is not anywhere near as good as the ND because the Kokusan outputs at 6000RPM and 3000RPM are ~15 amps and 13 amps respectively.

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GT550A Mint & Original
H2A Semi-Hot Rod Built From A Basket Case
KZ650C2 Mint & Original...mostly
GSF1200SK6 Bandit...My LD Ride
Additional H2 projects In Boxes.....
MBD Sufferer


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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 12:25 pm 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2008 5:55 pm
Posts: 3972
Location: Lancaster Pa.
Country: US
Bikes owned: GT750 x2 97 -1200 Bandit 86 GSXR1100
These charts show the GT750 at 280 watts............... http://www.oldjapanesebikes.com/mraxl_G ... /sr05.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; ..........and the 550 at 210 watts............ http://www.3cyl.com/mraxl/gt/manuals/gt ... /550-4.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 8:21 pm 
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Moto GP
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Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2010 4:32 pm
Posts: 3276
Location: southwestern Pennsylvania
Country: USA
Bikes owned: 69 T350 thru 75 GT750
The 80W alternator output is for the Powerdynamo kit.

The Powerdynamo kit replaces the stock ignition system and alternator. So all you get is the 80W output for lighting.
A sample output curve is shown here:
http://old.vape.cz/images/charka_alternatory_103_vykon_vnitrni.gif

As you've pointed out, the stock GT380/GT550/GT750 alternators have much more output, even when factoring in the power used by the ignition system. Suzuki provided output curves for the stock alternators on page 18 of: http://www.ozebook.com/compendium/suzi/suzidata1.htm

_________________
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 project & 75
GT380 72
T500 73 project
T350 69, 71 & 72 project
T250 72
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE


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