No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips appreciated

All to do with wiring, charging or just trying to figure out whats gone wrong.

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Ramjam
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No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips appreciated

Post by Ramjam »

HI
Apologies to the moderators if anyone's annoyed about me starting a new thread on an old subject, but the old one just stopped dead at a certain point and i have a new photo which i would ask membrs to look at. I have no spark and i am wondring what have done wrong when i put all the connectors back together.

Please give me any tips on stage-by-stage check points in the bowl as at the kill switch block i have at least power coming to it in the middle pin, if that helps

Many thanks for all your patience.

MJ in Beirut
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jabcb
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by jabcb »

No problems, we are not annoyed.
Its just that your wiring has been modified a bit & we aren’t sure what was done, so we ran out of suggestions.

Can you read the wiring diagram that I posted in your other topic?
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=12778

If the bike was in front of me, I would disconnect all the stock Suzuki connectors while leaving the modified connector alone.
(The two twist-on connectors are not not stock.)
And then try to figure out how it was modified.
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 & 75
GT380 72
T500 69 project & 73 project
T350 69 & 71
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE
rngdng
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by rngdng »

I feel sure that you have managed to ground the ignition circuit somehow. The kill switch and ignition switch ground the ignition in basically the same way, so I would start there. Wiring is never much fun. Good luck. I have a similar project going on a Yamaha right now.


Lane
If you stroke it more than twice; you're playing with it.

Too many bikes, too much time, ENOUGH SPACE, FINALLY! Never enough money.........
Ramjam
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by Ramjam »

jabcb wrote:No problems, we are not annoyed.
Its just that your wiring has been modified a bit & we aren’t sure what was done, so we ran out of suggestions.

Can you read the wiring diagram that I posted in your other topic?
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=12778

If the bike was in front of me, I would disconnect all the stock Suzuki connectors while leaving the modified connector alone.
(The two twist-on connectors are not not stock.)
And then try to figure out how it was modified.

I did read it and it was helpful. But as the other post suggests, it seems that i have grounded the ignition system somewhere and looking into the bowl, it's not at all obvious
Ramjam
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by Ramjam »

rngdng wrote:I feel sure that you have managed to ground the ignition circuit somehow. The kill switch and ignition switch ground the ignition in basically the same way, so I would start there. Wiring is never much fun. Good luck. I have a similar project going on a Yamaha right now.


Lane
Please explain what you mean about the kill switch and ignition switch. Where/how do they ground? Is it possible that i just have not earthed it correctly? Also, you can see in my pic that the orange and orange/white cables which are part of the ignition kill switch are connected with the green block. The PO put a bridge on the block connectro which comes from teh handle bar kill switch, which i guess that woud make it permanently ON, right?
Ramjam
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by Ramjam »

jabcb wrote:No problems, we are not annoyed.
Its just that your wiring has been modified a bit & we aren’t sure what was done, so we ran out of suggestions.

Can you read the wiring diagram that I posted in your other topic?
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=12778

If the bike was in front of me, I would disconnect all the stock Suzuki connectors while leaving the modified connector alone.
(The two twist-on connectors are not not stock.)
And then try to figure out how it was modified.

OK, so if i dosconnect all the stock connectors, how would that help me identify where the problem is?
rngdng
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by rngdng »

Ramjam wrote:
rngdng wrote:I feel sure that you have managed to ground the ignition circuit somehow. The kill switch and ignition switch ground the ignition in basically the same way, so I would start there. Wiring is never much fun. Good luck. I have a similar project going on a Yamaha right now.


Lane
Please explain what you mean about the kill switch and ignition switch. Where/how do they ground? Is it possible that i just have not earthed it correctly? Also, you can see in my pic that the orange and orange/white cables which are part of the ignition kill switch are connected with the green block. The PO put a bridge on the block connectro which comes from teh handle bar kill switch, which i guess that woud make it permanently ON, right?
Kill switch is from the right handlebar pod. Ignition switch is where the key goes. Both ground out the ignition signal when turned off. I can't tell from the pictures what has been done. I would use a wiring diagram and a meter to chase down the problem.


Lane
If you stroke it more than twice; you're playing with it.

Too many bikes, too much time, ENOUGH SPACE, FINALLY! Never enough money.........
Ramjam
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Posts: 254
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:28 am
Country: Lebanon
Suzuki 2-Strokes: gsx 750R, GPZ 750, GT380
Location: Lebanon

Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by Ramjam »

rngdng wrote:
Ramjam wrote:
rngdng wrote:I feel sure that you have managed to ground the ignition circuit somehow. The kill switch and ignition switch ground the ignition in basically the same way, so I would start there. Wiring is never much fun. Good luck. I have a similar project going on a Yamaha right now.


Lane
Please explain what you mean about the kill switch and ignition switch. Where/how do they ground? Is it possible that i just have not earthed it correctly? Also, you can see in my pic that the orange and orange/white cables which are part of the ignition kill switch are connected with the green block. The PO put a bridge on the block connectro which comes from teh handle bar kill switch, which i guess that woud make it permanently ON, right?
Kill switch is from the right handlebar pod. Ignition switch is where the key goes. Both ground out the ignition signal when turned off. I can't tell from the pictures what has been done. I would use a wiring diagram and a meter to chase down the problem.

WHERE do they both "ground out" exactly? In the bowl itself? Telling me "Kill switch is from the right handlebar pod. Ignition switch is where the key goes" isn't much help. I'm not an idiot.

If i didn't have the correct earths inside the bowl connected would that effect the ignitition?


Lane
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jabcb
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by jabcb »

Ramjam wrote:
jabcb wrote:No problems, we are not annoyed.
Its just that your wiring has been modified a bit & we aren’t sure what was done, so we ran out of suggestions.

Can you read the wiring diagram that I posted in your other topic?
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=12778

If the bike was in front of me, I would disconnect all the stock Suzuki connectors while leaving the modified connector alone.
(The two twist-on connectors are not not stock.)
And then try to figure out how it was modified.

OK, so if i dosconnect all the stock connectors, how would that help me identify where the problem is?
With the stock connectors all disconnected & everything spread out so we can see where all the wires go, we should be able to figure out how the wiring has been modified.
Knowing that, we should be able to figure out how to connect it up so that everything works.

You also mentioned something about the tach. A pic of the tach might be useful too.
BAS (Bike Acquisition Syndrome) - too many bikes but have room for more

Suzuki:
GT750 2x75
GT550 72 & 75
GT380 72
T500 69 project & 73 project
T350 69 & 71
Honda 85 CB650SC & 86 CB700SC
09 Triumph Bonneville SE
rngdng
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by rngdng »

If I could better answer your question, I would. We are trying to help with little to go on. I did not insinuate that you are an idiot Good luck. I'm out of this one.
If you stroke it more than twice; you're playing with it.

Too many bikes, too much time, ENOUGH SPACE, FINALLY! Never enough money.........
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tz375
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by tz375 »

You have identified the connector to the right bar switch. The Run switch has a three pin connector. Orange (power in), orange and white (power out to the ignition system) and a third that is either empty or light green/white which goes nowhere.

You may want to just follow where the "kill" switch wiring goes from the grip to the bowl and make sure you know which one it is and then find the matching socket with the same wires. Our bikes do not Ground out the circuit to Kill power. They are simple on-off switches that in the RUN position allow 12v power to flow to the coils.

So if the Orange lead has power when teh key is in the ON position, good. Next. test to see if the other lead (orange and white has power when the run switch is in RUN position and no power when OFF.

Any other result is not acceptable. Any bridging leads added by the PO should be removed as should any connections to any electronic tacho.

If that tests OK, go to the 6 pin coil connector and pull it and test to see if there is 12v at all three orange leads in the ON and RUn positions and zero power in any other switch position. You are testing the loom side - not the coil side in that one.
Ramjam
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by Ramjam »

tz375 wrote:You have identified the connector to the right bar switch. The Run switch has a three pin connector. Orange (power in), orange and white (power out to the ignition system) and a third that is either empty or light green/white which goes nowhere.

You may want to just follow where the "kill" switch wiring goes from the grip to the bowl and make sure you know which one it is and then find the matching socket with the same wires. Our bikes do not Ground out the circuit to Kill power. They are simple on-off switches that in the RUN position allow 12v power to flow to the coils.

So if the Orange lead has power when teh key is in the ON position, good. Next. test to see if the other lead (orange and white has power when the run switch is in RUN position and no power when OFF.

Any other result is not acceptable. Any bridging leads added by the PO should be removed as should any connections to any electronic tacho.

If that tests OK, go to the 6 pin coil connector and pull it and test to see if there is 12v at all three orange leads in the ON and RUn positions and zero power in any other switch position. You are testing the loom side - not the coil side in that one.

Thanks terribly. This is hugely useful and a good starting point. I can't help feeling that it's not about connectors but something that i have DONE in pulling out the wires from the bowl and returning them. thanks again. Will update you

MJ
Ramjam
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Posts: 254
Joined: Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:28 am
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Suzuki 2-Strokes: gsx 750R, GPZ 750, GT380
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by Ramjam »

Ramjam wrote:
tz375 wrote:You have identified the connector to the right bar switch. The Run switch has a three pin connector. Orange (power in), orange and white (power out to the ignition system) and a third that is either empty or light green/white which goes nowhere.

You may want to just follow where the "kill" switch wiring goes from the grip to the bowl and make sure you know which one it is and then find the matching socket with the same wires. Our bikes do not Ground out the circuit to Kill power. They are simple on-off switches that in the RUN position allow 12v power to flow to the coils.

So if the Orange lead has power when teh key is in the ON position, good. Next. test to see if the other lead (orange and white has power when the run switch is in RUN position and no power when OFF.

Any other result is not acceptable. Any bridging leads added by the PO should be removed as should any connections to any electronic tacho.

If that tests OK, go to the 6 pin coil connector and pull it and test to see if there is 12v at all three orange leads in the ON and RUn positions and zero power in any other switch position. You are testing the loom side - not the coil side in that one.

Thanks terribly. This is hugely useful and a good starting point. I can't help feeling that it's not about connectors but something that i have DONE in pulling out the wires from the bowl and returning them. thanks again. Will update you

MJ

Am making some progress. There is power to the orange/white cable which i assume goes to the coils. So, i can assume that the problem is at last now in the bowl of spaghetti
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tz375
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Re: No spark after headlight bowl re-connect - tips apprecia

Post by tz375 »

So far so good. Now lift the tank and locate the small 6 pin connector to the coil pack. Separate the halves and see if you have power at all three orange pins ( with it switched on)
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